Why does everyone keep comparing Chevy to Nissan? It is apples and oranges ... and I hope it stays that way.

Of all the high-power sportscars in the world, why pick the crappiest of the bunch and say that is what Nissan should shoot for? If the Camaro is so great, why are we wasting time waiting for the Z? It is fine if you like Chevy, but I think Nissan is a much higher quality vehicle. I test drove the Camaro with the Vette engine and, despite the power, I hated the car. Everything your hand touches in a Nissan feels well-built. Everything your hand touches in a Camaro feels cheap.

Don't go to Dillard's and complain about the shirts because they are so much higher than Wal-Mart. If you want a Wal-Mart quality shirt, stick to Wal-Mart. I, for one, don't want a Camaro-quality Z car.

 

The F-bodies make 325hp, at least thats what GM claims, they on dynos though they tend to make about 345hp.

 

Ummm what are you talking about? Have you ever actally seen the interiors of some of Nissans cars/ Much less the cheap steel they made their body panels from? If Nissan was such high quality Motortrend wouldnt constantly trash the Infinity line when compareing it to Cadaliac, Lincoln, and Lexus.

 

Are u insane?

Ever seen the interior of a Infiniti Q45? Nissan Maxima?? Now go sit down in a Camaro (or any friggin Chevy). If u think the Chevy has a higher build quality, then you are somking some strong stuff. Where did Motortrend trash the Infiniti??
Read the review they did on the Q45 and tell me. My sister has a Camaro Z28, yeah they are fast, but they are built CHEAP. After two years, plastic pieces inside rattles and fell apart. Also, its been in the dealer several time (tranny, brakes, etc..). Its a POS.
Also, cheap steel?? Prove to me that they use cheap steel.
BTW, I own a 1994 Q45t. If you find something about this car that is bad, let me know.

 

I don't think people are saying to shoot for a, your right, crappy car like a camaro. The are talking about the horsepower of the motor only. Of course, we don't want our Z to be an overweight, crummy handling car like firebird/camaro, and it won't be. It will be lightweight and have razor sharp handling. Hopefully like an S2000.

 

We arent talking the "feel" of the car, we are talking about the motor.

I dont know where you get your stats but Chevy makes **** good motors, and having the CORVETTE engine inside a car that costs a tad over $20k means THEY CAN DO IT.

 

RE: Are u insane?

The maxima and the camero are diferent cars though. The camero is a sports car, the maxima is a luxury car.

I do love the interior of the maxima though, everything in black leather, very cool.

 

hold on now Chevy and GM boys in case you didn't notice this site is about Z cars not camaros and corvetes.
2-If you wanna buy a corvette for 50K thats fine but i can give you a twin turbo z that will smoke that corvette up at any time and the Z after all the work done costs only 30k. come to staten island .
3-we all now the "reliability"of american cars ,being those sports cars or sedans or luxury sedans.please lets get real,we are talking about Maximas,Q45.people bought these cars in 1987 and now these cars have more then 200k miles ,they still run great.i doubt that an american GM or Pontiac can be in that level.

 

Fair enough, but....

In all reality, the Corvette has more speed potential than the 300ZX TT. You would have to heavily mod a 300ZX TT to keep up with a n/a vette ZO6. Supercharged vettes are extremely, extremely, fast.

I don't hate chevy's, but I don't necessarily love them either. Yes, the Camaro/Firebird is a shoddy car, but the vette is a very well designed car. Handles very well, VERY rigid chassis, excellent brakes, etc. But, yes, it is a very expensive car too.

 

antiquated engine design!!

One thing we all forget is that the Chevy Small Block engine is what 50 YEARS OLD??? (I know they have REFINED it over the years but the basic design dates back to the 50's.) So with a Vette you get great handling,speed and an OLD engine. They should be able to offer the Vette at a lower price, say 30k for openers with the Z06 topping 40k. The only reason they price it so high is to give the impression that the car is "exotic" when it clearly is not. Pleas do not think I am crackin on the Vette, just callin' a spade a spade. As far as the Z28 is concerned, that car fell of the map the day they added the Corvette engine in my opinion. The "formula" for the modern "pony" car was a 5 liter engine. Chevy got tired of getting it's butt kicked by Ford Mustangs and upped the ante with the 5.7.
Notice how F-bodies cost less than 30k? because they saved cash on engine development by using the small block 5.7, ****, they even de-tune them so they won't BEAT the Vette!!!mattz280 wrote:
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RE: antiquated engine design!!

Ok, I agree that the 350 chevy is not the most up to date design, but the vette still holds its own against almost any sports car at any price. 40k is not asking too much for the vette. Lets be realistic. Look at the camaro. The only reason its inexpensive is because it has a big engine and everything else is econo-car quality. Ok, it has decent brakes. $30k these days buys you an average car. The cheapest car on the road that outperforms the vette is the $70k viper. In addition to that, the Corvette has everyday driveability. I am a big Z fan, but let's face it, the C5 vette is a much better designed and performing car then the late 300ZXTT. Also, all of this "exotic" stuff is bullshit. Fine, if you want to spend $80k on a relatively ugly 911 that does not perform as well as the vette and has a pathetic back seat, fine. The 4.6 V8 in the mustang is not exactly exotic either. GM realises not to mess with a successful formula.

 

Why don't you get lost.....

Listen @!#$, every single post I've ever seen from you has been negative towards the Z. In case you didn't notice, this is a ZCAR FORUM. Another reason why you're an idiot is that you're using american luxury cars as examples against Nissan. American cars put all the money into useless electronic gizmos and use cheap materials and engineering. Is it safe to say Nissan's aren't as nicely built as Audi's/BMW's? Yes. Cadillacs and Lincolns? No way.

Unfortunately, this is the internet and I can't physically kick your ass out, but maybe you should consider not visiting this site if your only mission is to put the Z down and contradict everyone else's opinion.

 

I know you can quote stats all day

You keep talking about my stats, but I never bring up any stats. Where are you seeing these stats?

We are talking about more than just a motor. People keep saying "if Chevy can build a 300 HP car for under $30K, why can't Nissan?" Well, why can't BMW, Porsche, Acura, Jaguar, etc??? The answer is -- everyone of them could! They could throw a 300HP engine on a pair roller skates and sell it for $10K -- but does that mean it would be a good deal? No! Can you see what I'm getting at? The whole point is they would be sacrificing the quality that sets them apart from the Yugos and Daewoos of the world. Nissan may not be as high quality as Porsche, but I hope to God the new Z doesn't end up as low quality as Camaro.

By saying Nissan can build a sportscar to match the Camaro in BOTH HP AND PRICE is to ask Nissan to build a car just as crappy as Camaro. I'm sorry if you like Camaro and they may have wonderful engines (though I much prefer the sewing machine precision feel of the last Z engine), but there is "sports car" wrapped around that engine that was built cheap to keep the price low.

Like I said before, if Camaros are so great, why are we waiting for the Z?

 

RE: I know you can quote stats all day

Why I am not driving a camero? Because I dont like to drive the same car as everyone else. If I get a mustang, camero, or firebird. ANYTHING I do to it will have already been done to probably hundreds of cars in MN alone. I like originality.


The argument was the horsepower for under 30k. In fact nissan said the price would be at about 30k. The camero is $22k (aprox 30% gain in price). We will be paying aprox $8k more so thats probably where your styling will come into play. Add about 30% to a $50k corvette and you almost have a porsche.

 

RE: antiquated engine design!!

guys , guys pleaseeeeeeee!
just do the ratio $$$/speed and you'll realize that u are not getting nothing special by Chevy.for that kind of money you could buy a Porsche RGT from Germany and is worth the money(the ZO6 is about 70k right).The dashboard on all the Vettes ratles like i've never seen or heard in a Japonese car.By the way the new M3 is on the way,you would still consider buying a Vette??????About that Z that can not beat a ZO6,wellllllll think again.in Staten island , NYC happened.Of course the Z was modified and the guy who has it poured about 15K into it.but do the math still cheaper than the Vette isn't it?

 

RE: Are u insane?

Prove to you that they use cheap steel? Wall through a parklot sometime and see how many Nissans from the 80s have holes rusted through the finders. find me a pre 90 maxima that actually has its paint left on it.

 

RE: Why don't you get lost.....

They're not negative, they're reality based, Some folks on here like your self want a 6000hp top fuel motor in a Z for 3 dollers and it isnt going to happen. Your not going to beat a 325 hp car with a 6 speed with a 200hp some smaller displacement motor. your not going to get a car under 2400lbs for under 30,000 dollers. You'll find my messages arnt just bad mouthing nissan more so asking where some of you people get your foolish ideas from. there are a hand full of folks on here that a rooted in reality and dont post this nonsense, but the rest of it... who knows. I was compareing them to the Infinity line so yes that is apples to apples or perhaps your attention span was to short and you didnt read the whole post. as for american dealers spending to much time on eletronic gizmos on luxuray cars, ummm where are you been in the past 10 years? Have you ever seen an Acura CL, Or a Lexus GS400? How about a Volvo? BMW 5 series? Anything Dalmer-Chrysler has made? What do you call those navigation systems that all of theses makers are offering? They seem to be the same 'useless electronic gizmos' that Lincoln and Cadalac offer.

 

RE: I know you can quote stats all day

You also must perfer loosing in stop light drags to most mini vans unless you bought the twinturbo model. as for build quality? The 300ZXTT steering system was a peice of garbage, it breaks constantly and costs major money to fix. If Nissans such a great company, why did Renault have to bail them out? I'm not saying the Camaro is the best car in the world, I personnaly drive a 1991 Mustang LX. But for the price you cant beat it, find me another car that offers 325hp, 6 speed, .95g in the skid pad, low low 13 1/4 mile times, 17 inch rims for under 30,000 bucks.

 

RE: antiquated engine design!!

Guys , Gals , whatever . With fuel prices world wide getting pretty **** high Nissan would be cutting their own throat by attempting to mix it in the superclass sports car range as they did ( very successfully ) with Z32tt.The very soul of Z's the 240z was a mid range , well sorted , sexy , well priced sports car with an almost hypnotic appeal that crossed all sorts of boundarys.Nissan can't afford to play the hp game with the likes of G.M.Mazda showed the way with the MX5 and S1 RX7.$$$$$ales success depends on a total pacage with BROARD appeal.
My 2 cents (worth even less in NZ dollars)

 

RE: Why don't you get lost.....

First off, you can't go making any assumptions based on your empty knowledge. I do not think I can get huge horsepower for $3. I am looking at 250 hp n/a for $5000 US. I would have to say that is realistic. Navigation systems are only the beginning, my friend. Aside from the fact that they are almost always options I'm talking about night vision, electronic suspension, automatic windshield wipers, power door closers, heads up display, etc. etc. More over, I wasn't referring to the fact that these things are bad, I was pointing out that the american automakers don't know where to spend the money. Gadgets are fine, but quality and performance has to come first and they don't realise that.

Oh, by the way, there are many sub 2400lb cars for under $30, 000. I.e. Honda Civics, Toyota Corolla.......lots of other little economy cars.

Let's also not forget that it's all about power to weight ratio when it comes to performance. Just because a car has a giant engine doesn't mean that it's fast. Look at the Cadillac DeVille. It has 300 hp but is about as quick as a 160hp Civic Si.

 

Renault bailout

There are probably a variety of reasons. My speculation is this:

Nissan's entry-level vehicles have not been as reliable as Toyota and Honda's (don't know if this has changed with the new Sentra), and Nissan's overall reliability image is not as good as Toyota and Honda's.

I could be wrong, that's just my opinion.

By the way, Honda and Toyota are more Nissan's direct competitors than GM.

So how about Camaro? If it is so great, why has GM continued to bail it out all these years (we all keep hearing it is not a money-maker)?

 

Just can't see it happening

Oh well. I can see a pretty nice vehicle being produced for under $30K. I just don't see a pretty nice vehicle with 300 HP for that price coming from Nissan (or Toyota or Honda).

 

You think every american car is like Ford.

My plymouth voyager has 207k miles on it, and it has never had a good tuneup except for spark plugs,wires and oil done waaaay too late (plugs were WAY worn).

I would have no problem buying most chevys. You will never find me in a ford car though, their transmissions are garbage

 

RE: antiquated engine design!!

My old mans 98 dosnt rattle, and I live in minnesota where the roads are horsesh**!

 

RE: camarro or firebirds last year

yeah, the camarro is out for good isn't it? last year? or is that the firechicken?