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Car Show Bias

12K views 76 replies 22 participants last post by  Tony D 
#1 ·
I have a nice 79 280ZX that I have had for the last year and a half. I have taken it to 7 or 8 car shows over that time. I won two awards in the foreign or import classes. Most of the shows have a top 20 or 25. I like walking around and looking at all the old cars. The thing that bugs me is that I don't get the respect I should get when I know my car is better than a large percentage of the cars there.

There is a real bias against foreign cars at most of the car shows. I always have lots of people come by and complement my car and talk about the 240 they had or the ZX they had but nobody votes for me it is very frustrating. Have any of you who go to shows run across this?
 
#2 · (Edited)
You're probably going to the wrong car shows. Years ago, I had a business restoring Jags, Triumphs and the like and we showed them at British or European shows and they did very well. I've also taken the '79 ZX to shows that centered around domestic or hot rod types of cars and my experiences were similar to yours. I don't know where you're located, but, here in DC, I'm not aware of any Japanese-themed shows, although I think there's a potential market there. California is probably the best place to show a Z or ZX.

That said, based on the attention they receive, I reckon it's just a matter of time 'til ZXs become one of the next IT cars. Then, I think you'll begin to see more venues for showing them.
 
#8 ·
There's a cruise place on the east side of town called "Little Anthony's". I'm on the NW side so making it is an effort.I had the Z there a couple of years ago.I won my class. When they were handing out the trophies,the fat assed DJ says over the PA :they gave it to this? Talk about zero to Nuclear reaction in 2 seconds flat. I should have smashed his mic with my trophy.
 
#9 ·
"The thing that bugs me is that I don't get the respect I (THINK) should get when I (THINK I) know my car is better than a large percentage of the cars there."

Well boo hoo hoo, you got some sand in your pusa there buddy? You went to a car show to be judged and someone didn't pin a star on you for participation?

Man up and quit your goddamn whining! Maybe your car isn't as great as you think it is...

I watched a guy like you piss and moan at an MSA event one year picking faults on the car judged 'best of show' telling me why his car was so much better. Things like 'rivets are missing on the interior' (missing the fact that the panels were leather covered custom jobs to cover the integral decklid---no hatch there anymore), and 'The Shift Knob is screwey and nasty' (missing the fact that it was a 4 speed autobox into a 240Z with a custom center console, also leather covered) and how 'the battery doesn't have a cover' (missing the power steering pump, spark plug loom tube, triple SU's, and modern-looking engine covers on the mill to make it look more like an RB than an L-Series.)

The complainer? He had a ho hum all stock clean car. Big deal. What did you do to make it stand out? Nothing? You think a well maintained vehicle (the way it's supposed to be in the first place) entitles you to a trophy?

Big news son: Shows are about what sets the car apart, not just that it's clean. I suggest you take up another hobby because you lost all credibility and respect here by whining like you just did!
 
#10 ·
I am new here, but already like this Tony D guy. As much as we like Zs, the public may just perceive your car as an old Datsun.

I easily walk past 30-40 year old cars at shows. In fact, I have seen vehicles in shows recently that I thought a spectator had parked in the wrong spot. I do not yet see the appeal of a stock 70s or 80s vehicle at a show.

Heck, I own a 60 year old car that probably wouldn't get much attention.
 
#12 ·
Its better to be noticed when you drive by then to have ribbons and badges to wave. I only run into bias by other Japanese Car Import owners like my Acura driving classmate who is a douche. He bragged his mods on his glorified Honda civic etc etc then to shut him up I blew the doors off his Honda in my old NA. The other is the idiots with RXs who think the ZX is an RX or Nissan copied Mazda.

One time I brought my Z to a show my Highschools town throws and I had it parked out in the lot as I went and looked at all the nice MOPARS and GM pony cars and Mustangs and vettes I walked back and there was a group of people standing around the 83 ZX. 2 of them were judges to the car show. I walked by putting my Scout uniform in the back and the Judges asked why I wasn't in the car show. I said "Well I got a beat up primer 280ZX and all the cars there are nice." The judges laughed saying that its been the same cars in the same group for the last 20 years. It bearly changes accept for students with their dads old Road Runner or 78 Scottsdale and for Import category you got a chance."

I asked "why do I got a chance?" The judge said "Because it ain't a **** Volkswagen and it ain't a **** civic." As he chuckled. They told me their Z stories of owning one and regretting selling them followed by "Hang on to these cars. They may not be the prettiest or the fastest but they give you a life time of good memories.".

If your in to win, Huck your Z and buy a Barbie Camaro or a Fox body omni and brag how its the ****.
 
#13 ·
Car shows are meant to be fun experiences and show your car and all the work you put into it to the PUBLIC. I've gone to many shows when I was the only Z in a field of Detroit iron and I had many, many folks commenting about my car. Yeah, I've won a few awards, but they collect dust in the garage. It's fun at the time to win something, but someone always has something better: Z or other sports car. This September I was in a show and parked next to me was a $3 million 1955 Mercedes gull-wing. One of his stock wheels was worth more than my car. He won a prize but I also got as many admirers as he did. I was even in an all Datsun show and everyone raved about my car. Did I win anything, no...because there were better ones there, more rare, more pristine, more unique. So chill out and have a good time. Shows are not about the trophy awards, you are awarded each time someone ogles your car and tells you stories about the Z they once had.
 
#14 ·
The post above sums up my feelings on car shows also. I've been helping to organize shows for our Z club since its inception in 1999 (ZATTACK), and more recently several Nashville area shows with other "car" people (mainly charity events) and the Battlefield Region AACA club I also belong to.

The main thing is being there, interacting with the spectators and other entrants, representing our "brands" (Nissan and the Z) and having fun. Being in Nissan North America's corporate backyard makes it even more important to me to be a good brand ambassador. The awards to me should be and are secondary.
 
#18 ·
I live near Des Moines, Iowa and you don't see old Z cars around here. My friend has a 71 240Z and sometimes we go to shows together. We are the only Z owners who go to shows in the area. That is why I posted. I'm sure in CA or AZ there are hundreds running around. Not here.
 
#19 ·
I listened to a guy I've known for a long time on a phone call run down a local club meeting. Comparing it to what he saw in CA when I took him around.

He was the type of guy that run his mouth on everything in a derogatory manner. Go to a car show and it was "Oh, that car is nice BUT..." Seemed that EVERY car had something he didn't like about it (yet his crap box sat in its 1986 state with bondo scabs in the garage never moving...)

So he's deriding the local Ohio club, staring how "this idiot with a 280ZX pulled a wheelie and blew his front shocks..."

I was less than charitable at that point starting out with "Which car of YOURS pulls a wheel stand?" Give credit to those who take the field, not those on the sidelines criticizing.

As critical as I may seem to be, it's for those counterproductive wankers sniping at people DOING rather than TALKING that get that special dose of correction.

If your car doesn't stand out at ANY show...you're lost in the crowd. Nobody will vote for a 1950's Borgward Stationwagon on Super Chevy Sunday, either.

Now, put a Rat in it, a paint job that makes Boyd Coddington look like a preschooler using finger paints...and suddenly that 100 Point Small Block Chevelle doesn't get ANY attention.

Does it mean the Chevelle is any less of a car, that it took any less effort, any less time? No, it's just different. And with PEOPLES CHOICE that is what you get.

For Christ's sake, my Blue Turd 260Z somehow won "Best in Class" one year...the promoters photoshopped it to remove "paint texture" before putting it on their website. Several years earlier Bryan Blake was upset that the same car placed higher than his in PC Judging. But he entered "260Z Stock" class with a twin-turbo DOHC conversion...oops!

Presentation is everything at a car show. If it doesn't pop out and go "WOW" somehow, you will be passed over. If I see any more crying kiddolla on the bumper, I swear I'll boot it to the end of the street. Put that same doll under your front tire in a pool of red corn syrup and some chicken entrails oozing out from its shirt....now you got me looking. From there, it's up to you. Sit on a chair at the back....talk like a conceited arrogant wanker...then the oozing chicken guts become offensive. Answer questions, point out what you did, how you found the chicken guts and you may have gotten a vote for your car!
 
#20 ·
1)He was the type of guy that run his mouth on everything in a derogatory manner. Go to a car show and it was "Oh, that car is nice BUT..." Seemed that EVERY car had something he didn't like about it (yet his crap box sat in its 1986 state with bondo scabs in the garage never moving...)

2) If it doesn't pop out and go "WOW" somehow, you will be passed over. If I see any more crying kiddolla on the bumper, I swear I'll boot it to the end of the street. Put that same doll under your front tire in a pool of red corn syrup and some chicken entrails oozing out from its shirt....now you got me looking.
1)I just came from the Snottsdale Good Guys show-how much band width do we have here?

2)Yeah-I have had it with those "Time out Kids" too.Your idea will be made reality when the Z is back on the road.
 
#21 ·
I'll vote for your car!

Ever see a Garfield doll cut in 1/3's, and sewed to the mouth of a Shamu from Seaworld? Complete with sparkly red sequinned blood?

Welcome to the 1980 version of me being fed up with that fad and a mother that just was craft-crazy no matter how grotesque it seemed. The sequins were her idea!

:eek:
 
#22 ·
The guy mentioned went to a well known Datsun Restorer (Nissan Vintage Z resto-car program, in fact) and I got him a tour.

He was quiet through the whole tour, muttering an occasional "nice" or "impressive"... The owner says "so, how do you like our operation?"

FIRST WORDS SPOKEN: "Do you know what you need to do?" (Before waiting for an answer, continues...) "What you need to do is..."

Now, this guy didn't run a business. He hadn't run SHITE! But here he is going to tell a guy whom he's never met, and who arranged a shop tour on like ZERO notice...he's going to tell this guy how to run his business!

And he called ME negative! I decided his constant drama wasn't worth it. He was like a (bitch) in the way he would ask your opinion on what you think he should do about some problem, then get Pissedoff that you actually TOLD him what to do to SOLVE it from personal experience! Don't ask me what to do if you don't want an answer.

He was the testiculary unchallenged equivalent of ElaineZ. I came to understand (and actually knew it 20 years earlier) that he never wanted SOLUTIONS, he just wanted to endlessly TALK about it. Never fix or solve anything, just talk talk talk talk...

My time remaining on the earth was too valuable to be talked (literally) into the grave...

Guys, if you know someone like that, cut them free! You don't need that in your lives! Move to people who DO THINGS, and don't just TALK!!!

:mad:
 
#24 ·
More Fuel for the Fire

Was at a charity show on Sunday. They had two classes, Stock and Modified. There were 25 trophies for each class and I was in the Stock class. We had just short of 75 cars in Stock. The modified voted for stock, stock for modified. A 2009 Challenger won. Learned my lesson.
 
#26 ·
Was at a charity show on Sunday. They had two classes, Stock and Modified. There were 25 trophies for each class and I was in the Stock class. We had just short of 75 cars in Stock. The modified voted for stock, stock for modified. A 2009 Challenger won. Learned my lesson.
What lesson was that? That your car doesn't stand out in a crowd? Seriously... c'mon!
 
#25 ·
I have my own sentiments and feelings about Z cars at car shows and just car shows in general. now, i have a nice 280z mild custom and partially restored that is definately a show car. it has won an award, but with the previous owner at the helm. i took it to my local zcar club shows in 2007 & 2008 and didn't leave with any trophies. and that is just fine with me. it's cool to win an award for something that stands out on a particular car, especially if it is something that you worked hard on to earn, but "being given an award" is not everything. i think guys who get awards for their car and class probably deserve it. to me, the real reward is just being there regardless of what condition your car is in. i get more satisfaction when i hear people talk about my car and give it compliments on the way it looks or mods that have been done to it. or they say how much they like it. and if something i have done inspires someone else, that means even more. trophies are nice, but how many do you need, really? i don't know about everyone else, but I don't take my Z to a show to win... i go to participate and enjoy the other cars that are participating.... doesn't matter what all you do to your car to make it "best in class, or coolest car"... not everybody is going to like it or things you have done to it. guys & girls who win have earned it. the only thing that kind of bugs me is when the same person wins with the same car for the same thing, every single year. but i do not have hard feelings or criticism towards someone else because they won and i didn't. just owning and driving a Z is a priviledge. taking a Z to show is an honor. getting compliments on a Z is a pleasure. embrace it. enjoy the ride, not the trophy.

in all honesty, the last time i went to a show, i spent more time walking around looking at all the other Z cars of all years and classes, while leaving my car parked and opened up for all to see. as nice as it is, it didn't win anything. but i did leave the show with a nice free Z t-shirt and a lot of compliments. being there in one big setting to see all these cars, new and old, stock and custom, was the biggest reward for me. :grin

one of my goals and dreams is to one day take my Z out west to the Nationals. i don't expect to win. i just want to represent the 1976 280z in a class of many and to have fun. some day.....

Bonny
 
#27 ·
Why is it every guy that loses is crying 'car show bias' instead of looking at what's wrong with his car.

If getting someone else's approval is that important to you, then you need to WORK to give them what they want.

I have seen S30's take concours wins over domestics on more than one occasion. They are **** nice cars, and they stand out!
 
#28 ·
You do not know the culture

Tony Tony Tony
This is ******* country. There is a definite hatred against imports here.

My buddy and I were at a small car show where we live Saturday. He has a nice 71 240. While we were walking around picking the top 15 a guy asks my buddy to borrow his pen. My buddy says sure if you vote for my car. The guy says where is it. My buddy says its the bright yellow Datsun 240z. The guy says I would never vote for that thing!

On Sunday out of 73 cars in the stock class I was the only import.

I am only going to enter shows that have an Import/Foreign class. Too many ******** here.
 
#30 ·
Tony Tony Tony
This is ******* country. There is a definite hatred against imports here.

My buddy and I were at a small car show where we live Saturday. He has a nice 71 240. While we were walking around picking the top 15 a guy asks my buddy to borrow his pen. My buddy says sure if you vote for my car. The guy says where is it. My buddy says its the bright yellow Datsun 240z. The guy says I would never vote for that thing!

On Sunday out of 73 cars in the stock class I was the only import.

I am only going to enter shows that have an Import/Foreign class. Too many ******** here.
If I can see Datsuns winning at Woodward in Detroit, and at concours shows, it's your preparation, not 'the culture'...

I've been 15, you stick around long enough you will realize....if you're honest with yourself....that your car as it sits right now is nothing special. It's just an old Datsun and you got nothing special to make it stand out.

This is the umpteenth time I've said this, and YOU JUST AREN'T (don't want to) HEARING IT: IF you want to win ANY car show, the car MUST STAND OUT!

You are exhibiting the same "*******" culture in your example! "Vote for my car if I loan you my pen" how pathetic is THAT? Just because it's a Datsun, doesn't mean it DESERVES votes. Chances are good you will come to MSA one year and walk away empty handed as well.

"Clean Cars" are on used car lots all the time. There's nothing special about them.

What I find most curious, is for someone CLAIMING to have this stunning 100-point perfect show car that should WOW cross-clan crowds...you haven't posted a SINGLE photo of your car in the show, or of your car period. You think because you are the 'only import' you supposedly STAND OUT? Think again! For most show goers you got a funny looking Corvette, and there are plenty of shinier newer Corvettes out there.

I smell B U L L S H I T!

This is nothing more than a kid who isn't getting his Barney Star and can't stand that nobody thinks his car is anything special other than himself and his cadres. Like grandpappy used to say "screwin' yer sister ain't right, no matter what yer friends think!"

Face the possibility it's your car, and not the show goers.
 
#29 ·
Shows of anything - cars, dogs, guns, whatever - are going to be subject to the whims of, well, pretty much anybody who attends. Part of the fun is appreciating the nice cars and enumerating the cons of the ones you don't. And as mentioned above, it's part of the ******* code that any true, red-blooded 'Murcan HAS to kneel at the altar of the Big Three and hate anything imported. (Even if you're really only a Chevy guy and hate Fords and Mopars, too?) It's just like owners of Rottweilers sneering at Chihuahua people - and vice versa. Unless you're female and/or really honestly don't care, a car is not just a car. It represents some aspect of the owner's personality, and there's always the possibility someone expressing something negative is taken as a personal insult to you: I don't like your car, therefore I must not like you. This applies to all cars, be they American, a Z, a Yaris or a Bentley. It is pointless to let it get to you.
And c'mon, taking a Z to most predominantly American-car meets is just asking for abuse. Even if there's a SBC under the hood. They don't like your pristine survivor Z - maybe you don't like that guy's pristine survivor Edsel. Solution? Attend only shows of like-minded cars and people. The Z-car Western Nats is a fabulous event. I once took my diehard Chevy-loving buddy and he loved it. Of course, he was vastly outnumbered...
 
#31 ·
And Chihuahua's aren't dogs. They're shaved rats. Hard to clean out of your boots after stompin' and not fit for a Rottweiler's snack!

Terribly b a s t a r d-bred animals. Terrible terrible terrible. I've met one in 50 years that was worth it's weight. Every other I've seen has been ill-tempered, snappy, bitey and owners excuse poor breeding as 'they can't hurt anybody, what's the harm?' Until it latches on the newborn toddler's face one day.
 
#32 ·
Go Here to go "Ho Hum"

Frankly, your engine bay is filthy, and the rest of the car is just a daily driver. There is nothing that I would vote for on it either.

Sorry, but you don't want to hear your car doesn't measure up, but it's just an old Datsun, and there's nothing special about it. You would be faceless in the crowd at MSA, or any other Z-CON. In fact, if that car was put into ZCCA Judging, you would be VERY Disappointed by the outcome judging by your representative photos.

Nobody wants to look in the mirror, but in this case...you really need to. . . This car isn't 'car show winner' material. I can pick half a dozen off the street in SoCal, AZ or NV that would BLOW this car into the weeds visually, and they're DAILY DRIVEN and DON'T go to shows!

Sometimes the truth hurts. If you want to win trophies, make the car stand out.

You are just going to be upset at an Import show....so then it's going to be "I'm going to an Import Show with "Pre-85 Datsun Class"

And then, "Mist Blue 280ZX Class Stock Daily Drivers with Hood Closed Class"

If you eliminate any competition, does your 'class win' mean anything?
 
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