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Danm transmission drain plug!

2K views 40 replies 10 participants last post by  dumbestone 
#1 ·
Ok well, i was going to change the transmission fluid of my 91 tt the other day but found the drain plug stripped by the previous owner. I tried to make the best of the little "meat" left on the plug and used the car's jack to put pressure on the breaker bar connected to the plug but now the whole thing is a circle :(
I tried using a bolt extractor but it broke and half of it still remains inside of the plug. That plug is really tight in there. I think that some threadlock is taking part in all of this.
So now, i am stuck in my garage have now money to get it towed to a shop and get it fixed there. There is no oil in the tranny so i cant move it and it will leak a lot if any is added (tried that). I have basic tools and not a lot of space to work in. I need to have this car running really soon.

(I dont have a welder)

Any suggestion on how i can get this darn thing out? Its really hard for me to try things under the car. Can the tranny be removed and put back by one person, his muscles and cinder blocks for support? How heavy is that thing anyways?

I am open to any suggestion that will get the job done fast and "cheaply"
thxs
-Alex P.
 
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#2 ·
maybe you can drill a hole in the middle of the plug then reverse thread it with a heli coil or something

Find a bolt that will fit the heli coil and use that to screw it out.

There might be some easier ways though, just a thought
 
#3 ·
KyleKidd Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> maybe you can drill a hole in the middle of the
> plug then reverse thread it with a heli coil or
> something
>
> Find a bolt that will fit the heli coil and use
> that to screw it out.
>
> There might be some easier ways though, just a
> thought

Unfortunately, after breaking the screw extractor, i drilled 4 holes(tried more but couldnt) on the corners of the drain plug to see if i could remove the suck bolt extractor by breaking that center piece of. Unfortunately that dint work. I still have the extractor suck in there. it is made out of steel so i cant really create a nice whole to put a big enough heli coil.
even if i managed to take the extractor out, i would still not be able to drill a perfect hole because of the small holes that I already drilled which started flush to the corners of the plug and most likely not deviated away from the center of the plug :(

I really appreciate your suggestion KyleKidd but I cannot apply it because of what has already been done to the drain plug.
Thxs again and keep the ideas coming :)
-Alex P.
 
#4 ·
what I would do is just degrease it, stuff it with jb weld or similar and stuff the shortest extension into it and just let it sit for 24 hours, next day... you know what to do =P

it has worked before with good results... specially if the inside is roughed out and not completly round (as you mentioned you drilled the crap out of it)
 
#5 ·
salvadoran300zx Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> what I would do is just degrease it, stuff it with
> jb weld or similar and stuff the shortest
> extension into it and just let it sit for 24
> hours, next day... you know what to do =P
>
> it has worked before with good results...
> specially if the inside is roughed out and not
> completly round (as you mentioned you drilled the
> crap out of it)


O wow, I never knew about this product (i am new to mechanics). I am definitely going to try it out tomorrow. You know, before i was thinking about using the expandable foam that you sometimes see in bridges but this seems much better. My only challenge is going to be fighting gravity (hopefully the product is very viscous)
Many thanks salvadoran300zx
I'll keep this thread updated.
I am still open for other suggestions in case... or for future reference
thxs
-Alex P.
 
#6 ·
Getting a broken extractor out is a bitch because they are made of high carbon steel or other very hard metals (which is why the break). When I had an extractor to get out I used a dremel with diamond tip cutters and even with those it is a slow process that requires a lot of patience and lubricant.
 
#7 ·
jb weld will be viscous enough to hold upside down, just beware you won't be able to take out the extension ever again =P that is the only down side, but beats the price of a tow truck and shop rates =P
 
#8 ·
Sal-

A 'different' idea that might work better, is to see if you can JB weld in one of those giant slot-screwdrivers with the square shaft. The flat-head will have a better chance of not rounding out the JB Weld, and you can grab the shaft with a large adjustable wrench.
 
#9 ·
Just a little confused about something. There are two plugs on the manual trany. There’s one on the bottom and one on the side. You drain through the bottom and fill through the top.

Did you drain the fluid through the bottom without first checking if you could open fill plug? Which plug is currently stripped? I'm betting it's the fill plug. Say to yourself “Make note to self…. Never pull the drain plug until you know you can open the fill”.;) Sorry couldn’t resist.

I have an idea if you find you can't remove the top plug:

If the bottom plug is accessible and open you can still fill the trany through it. You use a cork or rubber plug that fits the opening and drill a hole through the center. Insert a plastic or metal tube through it. Connect the tube to one of the oil hand pumps you can buy at any auto parts store. You'd need it anyway to pump the gear oil into the trany's side opening. Fill the trany by pumping in the gear oil through the tube in the cork. Over fill it a little. Once filled you can then QUICKLY remove the cork and place the bolt into the drain hole. Just have a pan ready to catch the oil that falls out. If you're quick you wont loose much more then a couple tablespoon full. Just pull the cork with one hand and slide the bolt over with the other and screw it in place. Not as hard as it sounds.
 
#10 ·
Keane

I think the only problem with that would be that the shaft would be too thin to apply a lot of pressure on to it and if someone DID put locktite into the threads then the shaft of the screwdriver would be rounded as well...

another thing that you could stuff into the JB weld could be a star pointed tip and then you'd still have the 1/2" grip at the back and more contact surface than a square inside the plug itself

something like this

 
#11 ·
JT-

how much oil would the tranny take??? cuz I guess he wouldn't be able to check it later on if he doesn't unplug it...

and... wouldn't it be easier to remove the speed sensor and fill it in through there?
 
#14 ·
JT240Z Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Just a little confused about something. There are
> two plugs on the manual trany. There’s one on the
> bottom and one on the side. You drain through the
> bottom and fill through the top.
>
> Did you drain the fluid through the bottom without
> first checking if you could open fill plug? Which
> plug is currently stripped? I'm betting it's the
> fill plug. Say to yourself “Make note to self….
> Never pull the drain plug until you know you can
> open the fill”.;) Sorry couldn’t resist.

Its not the fill plug that stripped its the drain (the one at the bottom). I also made sure to take out the fill plug 1st ;). I drained the the oil through the hole that i made for the extractor which broke later on.

Posted by: salvadoran300zx
>oh well... in that case that would do the trick too

>but I'd still prefer to be able to lock in a breaker bar into it... just a >thought

I this is my setup but instead of using the star sockets i just just used and 1/2" extension for clearance and less variables to fail.I rather use the breaker bar rather then using the screw diver/adjustable wrench setup. I feel that i am going to exert a large amount of torque to get that thing out and therefore dont really trust a large adjustable wrench because it still might strip the large screw driver and because the torsional torque my just break the head of the screw driver.
I applied the JB weld early this morning and took pictures of the drain plug (kinda blurry) and the setup with the paste.
http://picasaweb.google.com/tiale11/Drain_Plug#

I want to take out the drain plug to make sure that all the oil gunk and metal shards are out of the system (stuck on the drain plug's magnet). I saw a nice little preview of this when i took of the differential drain plug

I am planning to try to take it out tonight. I'll keep you guys/girls posted and will put up more pics
Thanks,
-Alex P.
 
#15 ·
that looks good... if it's not dry yet you could try push some of it back up with a cardboard and fix the cardboard somehow to hold as much as you can up there

about taking it out tonight... make sure you give it enough time to cure it has happened that it just turns hard on the outside layer and mushy on the inside where its not well cured

but you're on the right track!

good luck with that!
 
#18 ·
If a 1/2" ratchet won't take it out, snap ring pliers don't have a chance.

I'm skeptical of this 'JB Welding an extension in' idea, but if it works it will be a handy trick to know. If it doesn't, JB Weld the holes shut, fill the trans, and swap bellhousings at the first available opportunity.
 
#19 ·
Z1 ZONLY Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If a 1/2" ratchet won't take it out, snap ring
> pliers don't have a chance.
>
> I'm skeptical of this 'JB Welding an extension in'
> idea, but if it works it will be a handy trick to
> know. If it doesn't, JB Weld the holes shut, fill
> the trans, and swap bellhousings at the first
> available opportunity.


Well the JB weld failed miserably i would say mostly due to the whole setup being upside down resulting in a semi-filled drain plug.

I think not that the pliers will work. thxs for the suggestion tho

I dont want to plug the holes and drive because of all the metal shards and i really dont want to buy a new bell housing just yet because i am space, tool and money constrained.

Because i am running out of patience, money and because i need the car to run soon, I was wondering if any of you would like to take a crack at the drain plug. I will pay what i can for the service but that darn thing must be out. I am in the NYC area PM me if interested
thxs
-Alex P.
 
#20 ·
did you let the JB cure long enough? or did it fill up with oil dripping from the tranny?

I have used this before to remove head bolts that some other idiot stripped down, but it must cure completely before applying any torque to it.

This is an example... but has worked with big ones too

 
#21 ·
Unfortunately, there's not too much of anything you can do. Try putting a notch in it and using a hammer and punch to spin it CCW. If that doesn't work, I'd continue to try drilling holes and punch it from the edges inward, trying to make it collapse in itself.
 
#22 ·
Well i let it cure for 18 hours and doubt that oil from the tranny leaked into it (the drain plug has had holes in it at least for 2 days before the JB was put in). I think that the failure is due to the air pockets made by when the paste leaked down a bit.
If i would have to retry it, i would probably take down the bell housing and apply the JB but this time make sure gravity inst an issue (flip the housing 180degrees)

This seems like it might be a giant pain for me because that thing looks really heavy and to make it worst, also looks like a tight fit. Again, I am alone, have a very confined space to work in.

Is removing and re-installing the bell housing as hard as i think it is? Can it be done by one person equipped with a few cinder blocks?
If its not too hard to do, i might give this JB weld another crack.

thxs
-Alex P.
 
#23 ·
Z1 ZONLY Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unfortunately, there's not too much of anything
> you can do. Try putting a notch in it and using a
> hammer and punch to spin it CCW. If that doesn't
> work, I'd continue to try drilling holes and punch
> it from the edges inward, trying to make it
> collapse in itself.


I was trying to do this but dint couldn't because of the broken extractor. I went to look for a whole saw that i could put on my drill but no luck with size.
 
#24 ·
Not sure how this will work with the Z, but I've done this trick on other cars.

The first thing you do, is drill a hole that is just barely smaller than the internal diameter of the threads (i usually do ~1/16" smaller), making sure it is as close to centered as possible. This might be difficult, and often requires some specialty bits! If you can't get this close, go a bit smaller than that, and grind as close to the thread-edge as you can with a dremel.

After you've done that, take a small punch up against the plug's remaining threads (Toward the middle!), and slam it with a hammer. What SHOULD happen is the threads start to peal off, since there is no backing material.

Finally, run a tap through the threads to clean them up, and you should be all set.
 
#25 ·
OK, here's my advice at this point. Forget the JB Weld idea to remove the plug. It's not likely to work on anything that size. If the aluminum 1/2 square stripped by trying to remove it then the JB Weld will not work either. The snap ring tool idea is even more of a joke.

If you just want to get the car back on the road then here's what I would do. Fill the drain plug with whatever JB you have left. Put some duct or masking tape over it to stop it from leaking back out until it cures. Once cured you can fill the trany back up with gear oil and drive it. Done. The JB will act as an effective seal with no problems for years.

If you could get the dam broken EZ-out removed then you could drill a hole down the middle of the drain plug, tap it for a 1/2" pipe thread and put a pipe plug in it.

Either way will get you back on the road.
 
#26 ·
You said you had drilled 4 holes in the square corners of the plug. Not to count on any success, but have you drilled along the the sides of the extractor to the maximum diameter you can without going into the threads? If the extractor is big enough, the size of the drilled holes may relieve some of the diametral force of the plug threads against the drain hole.

If you have a piece of 1/4 or 3/8 steel flatbar you might be able to get Grade 8 bolts, cut short enough to let the flatbar lay flush against the plug, to fit snugly into the flatbar in a pattern to go into the drilled holes by the extractor. And rap on it to see if the plug moves. (I'd cover/plug the drilled holes with bolts to prevent flame from going inside the tranny and heat the case around the plug.) Just don't crush bang it to the point where the bolts go crushing the threads.
 
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